September 13, 2022

EPISODE 240: Want Coaching from Kat and Macy? Listen to Find Out How

Kat and Macy are busting a very common myth in today’s episode of the Guide Culture podcast. The belief that they’re debunking is one that countless people have asked in the past and will continue to ask in the future – “am I not selling because I don’t have enough followers?”

Far too often, people blame their smaller followings on Instagram for their lack of sales. However, Macy and Kat share why it isn’t a numbers game and why if you can’t sell to the people you already have, you won’t be able to sell to more. They kick off this conversation by discussing what good content is, what it means to truly sell, and the difference when you’re able to change and sell your prospect’s belief. Then, they continue on to share why strategies are a revolving door of ideas that ebb and flow depending on what works and what doesn’t. They also discuss how momentum comes from conversation and why it’s so important to speak with your prospects.

If you struggle with sales and believe the problem might just be the number of followers you currently have, this episode is for you! Just be sure to stay tuned to the end for an excited opportunity with Kat and Macy.

In this episode, we cover:

  • “Is your content good enough?” And what is good content to you?
  • What it really means to sell
  • What happens when you change and sell the belief
  • Why strategies are a revolving door
  • What to do if you can’t convert the people who you already have
  • The momentum that comes through conversation

Apply now for the 9/20 workshop: https://guideculture.kartra.com/page/workshopapp922

Kat
Welcome back to another episode of School of Sales by Guide Culture. Today, I want to open up the curtain into a conversation that was had recently with a former leader of a $40 million company I mean a boss. And what I think fascinated me the most about this conversation was definitely kind of the inside nuts and bolts of it, which we’ll get into, but also how the similarities in problem and the objections that she had were very, very, very, very similar to everyone else. Because honestly, what happens when people contact Guide Culture, and they think that they want help with sales, is it really ended up all being kind of the same problem. And if we were doctors like the same illness, with the same root cause, and it is so incredibly simple to fix. And some of these thoughts on like her behalf and the problems that she’s experiencing, they’re just symptoms of like not really knowing exactly how to sell and want to open the curtain to what those looked like just in case you’re experiencing any of these two. And mainly, her problem was that she has this large following. She has built hundreds of 1000s of followers, very engaged people, when with her content, she has an incredible history of her accomplishment. Her accomplishments are incredible, I mean, you’d be blown away, like what the heck, we have the same problems like how is this possible, it’s because of the root cause that we’ll get into. And at the end of the day, this content she’s making for the hundreds of 1000s of people is not selling, which blows one assumption out of the water right out the gate, which is if I just had more followers, I know you’ve talked about it, but surely it’s a numbers game. And if my content is good enough, then people will buy. And I’m telling you, this woman, if she were right here with a third microphone, she would say don’t believe that lie. Because she is experiencing how fun it is to have content that helps people get wins, which it is, people are saying, oh my gosh, I got this amazing job using one of your tips, which is great. She also knows that this membership she sells would actually get people win.

Macy
Yeah, I was gonna ask because you were like, if my content was just good enough, I would ask you, our listener, like, what is good content to you? You know, because if it’s if content is good, that make people win like that, where they get the job. I know, I just did a sales call series, someone was like, hey, I learned just close the sales call in 20 minutes after watching your series. Yeah, that’s good content, and it helps people. But is it like really helping people to the best that I possibly could help them? Or that you could help them? Probably not. Because the best way you could help them is probably in your paid program, right? Probably. And that’s the whole point. And that’s the whole point of why you’re making content.

Kat
Yes, it’s the point of why you’re making content. It’s also the point of the true value of your program. Now what happens when you do, we’re about to pull the curtain open, but when you do that, when you just teach people how to do stuff in your content, and you educate and all these things, they can assume that they are giving your best when this woman was like hey, I’m like not even meaning to do this. And so they’re not buying, they got what they need because they got what they needed. And so what ended up happening through our conversation was you know, her concern/thing like oh, you know, I don’t know if I want to buy School of Sales the program because I think I want to do a High Level Mastermind instead. And this like by someone else, not ours. We don’t have our own mastermind. She wanted to either join Guide Culture School of Sales or do this High Level Mastermind. And the reason was that she could really be in a room with high level people and experience that, you know, exclusivity, which I totally get being around the right people is one of the most important things you can do. And so that was really good information to have in this conversation. And so I want to, honestly, if you are her, and if you have these things of, you know, I’m creating content and putting it out there, maybe it’s not for hundreds of 1000s of people, maybe it’s for hundreds. But you’re like, hey, it’s still not selling though. Because if you think about hundreds of people that have a lot of people, like when you think of individual humans, which we should think of it like that, because that’s what people are, individuals, then why isn’t that happening? And how can you get into a place where your content does make a difference for people in a way that’s bigger than just thanks for the tip? Okay, so the first thing that I want to tell you about the way you can be thinking about your content, is that you absolutely can nurture people and sell at the same time. I think it was in the recent years that Gary Vee would often say, you know, you give give, jab jab, hook, which means like, give, give, give, give, then you can sell. You kind of have to have this earned right to sell.

Macy
Right, which my question is like, what is selling to you then? Because that’s probably just to Gary, it’s probably just a call to action, which is like, buy my product, right? So it’s like, give him information, give information. And then it’s like, offer is probably what he is saying. Well, we what we believe is that when you sell a new perspective, a new way of thinking, that is what makes people buy. And that is nurturing.

Kat
It is nurturing, because what a true nurture is, if you think of like cultivating a plant, that you actually literally give it like nutrients, you give it life. And that’s what selling is. Because you’re not just selling the product like, hey, it’s $20 off right now, that’s not what selling is, selling is helping people think differently so that they are ready, they are ripe, they are blooming and ready to buy from you. And in this person’s case, she was saying about her content was hey, it’s helping people but they’re not buying. And so that leads us to the truth that teaching is not sales content.

Macy
No, it is not.

Kat
Giving the how to, like how to do your makeup, how to do your skincare routine, is not selling, it is demonstrating, which is fine. It is not convincing in that good way that people need what you have specifically. So you absolutely can nurture and sell at the same time. And honestly, every single day could be selling people toward what you have. And it’s not reserved for two weeks out of the quarter or for some stressful launch mode where it’s like, all your eggs are in that one basket because it’s like now it’s time to sell. You actually can be shifting people’s mind all the time.

Macy
Yeah, honestly, I just got an email from someone who’s like our nine step like pitch. I was like, oh, what is it? You know, it was honestly, it was how to do something. And from just like an outsider, it felt like so overwhelming for me because I just don’t know, we know how to quote pitch and I just like don’t even love the word pitch. But just like watching someone else’s thought process and seeing it all laid out, I was like, oh my gosh, like I just closed, I can’t look at that it stresses me out. And it made me think I was like, oh, I wonder if people read any of our content and think oh, that’s too much information, like that stresses me out. It totally turned me off. And what I wanted to say was like hey, there’s like you know, if like you have a hard time selling the objections, like I just want you to know it is so possible, like sell me on myself, sell me on like why I can do it and why I should like believe in myself. And then give me the how inside the paid program once I’ve already bought in, because if something is difficult, if something is hard to process, which a lot of you are selling something that is like your second language, but no one else has second language and so it’s going to take effort on their part to learn it. And when something takes effort, people’s brains shut off, my brain will 100% shut off. And so you want people to have a little skin in the game before you start giving the stuff that takes a lot of work to be able to understand

Kat
Not to mention that they might not even believe the right things. So an example might be let’s just say that like your makeup, let’s just say your makeup is like five minute makeup. And so you know that possibly the audience is like the 52 year old woman who like has not gotten ready but you might love her know. So you’re like hey, this is like cream foundation. And this will take you five minutes and you will feel so much better. Go and play with her granddaughter, so that’s what you believe your heart is just pure for it. And still, that person’s like, no, I don’t do makeup, I just think it’s not who I am. Instead of saying buy my thing, buy my thing, buy my thing, you actually help their brain see themselves as worthy and never too late. They are not too old, it is not too late. And sell that belief before they’re ready, because they would not be ready. We don’t need more by my compact, right, they need to believe in themselves like Macy said.

Macy
Yeah, exactly. And so there’s a way to do that in a very, like, quick and powerful way. So that people continue to watch and you know, their beliefs might not change in that instant. But it’s just like a little like, penny, I just think about like a weighing scale, just like a penny on the weighing scale. She’s like a little chip day by day by day where they’re like, wait, maybe I am somebody who’s like, worse, putting in a little blush in the morning. Maybe this will help me feel better. Heck, maybe I will perform better in the gym. I don’t know. Maybe I’m imagining her being like an athlete and being like, no one sees me, I’m always watching them. Maybe this will help me perform better in the gym. Like maybe this will make me like, want to talk to people when I make friends. I don’t have any friends. And suddenly, they’re like, wait, this is the most important thing for me to do right now is to learn how to put makeup on in five minutes, because the trajectory of my life has been a chain. Gosh, it’s crazy. And then there’s, once you’ve changed their belief, they’re like, wait, where do I get makeup now? Like, oh, the person who helped me think differently. I don’t go to Sephora, right, I go to the person that helped me believe in myself.

Kat
Gosh, and it’s so important that you do do this, that you sell the beliefs that people need to believe in order to buy from you. Because that tells them that they kind of vibe with you, you stand on the same ground, that you’re not just here to show people that you’re pretty. You’re here to say you know what, it matters that you are happy talking to the Starbucks barista, it matters that you’re excited to talk to your granddaughter’s teacher, because that changes their confidence in the classroom. So all of a sudden, it’s not even about you, but you’re fired up to do five minute makeup, because it’s a bigger deal than you ever knew. And again, it’s just that selfless, hey, this isn’t even about me. So that’s just the beauty of selling a belief and that nurtures people, how it nurtures their heart, and really pours into them, and changes their life because they’re thinking the correct way.

Macy
And like I love what you just said about nutrients and a plan is like, wait, what do you say? It will just nurture in nutrients. Okay, so think about like going back to makeup, is someone’s soul nurtured when they learn how to blend their crease? And their eyeshadow? Or like how to do a winged liner? Or is it nurtured when someone walks away being like, man, I’m like, worth putting on this makeup, so I’m gonna make some new friends. What actually nurtures the soul and makes you walk differently? It’s not the wing liner. It’s not the mascara. It’s how you see yourself.

Kat
So true. And nothing does that like helping people see value.

Macy
That’s a good way to think about like, when you’re talking about nurture content, how can I give someone nutrients to walk different, honestly.

Kat
Yeah. And so that’s just one of those components of selling them on themselves, in selling the right beliefs, because people just don’t even know, you know, maybe their mom, and their mom’s mom, and their mom’s mom’s mom said makeup was stupid. And someone helps shift your belief say, you know, this is actually really cool. Because your studies show that you smile more and that can make it look more friendly. And then you’ll make friends at Bunco night, when you think everyone hates you, they actually don’t, you just aren’t smiling. You know, you just never know, so it matters a lot to us the idea of selling in your nurture content for something that’s not your product, but what your product that will lead to. The next thing that was interesting in mine and in this sweet woman’s conversation was in this Mastermind she was told that she would go to sell her offer. And I thought this is really interesting language because being able to sell an offer is literally just like the way something is packaged. That’s it, so you have your product which just say it’s a membership course that is your product. And then your offer might say something like hey, when you buy this you get this plus one coaching call with me like that’s kind of the offer. It’s like a very intangible thing to be honest with you. So if you think about infomercials also it’s like but wait, you get extra this but it almost feels like irresistible, because it’s like what’s inside of it, a little bit. People say we’ve heard this from someone who has like a $30 million company, that if people don’t feel stupid saying no to you, then you don’t have a good offer. I personally don’t think that’s the right way to think, no one should feel stupid going one way or the other. It should feel like the right thing to do for their life at the time. But what’s interesting about offers in general is that they’re a bit of a strategy, because what matters in 2022 did not matter in 2018 and won’t matter in 2026. Okay, so it’s kind of this temporary strategy of relevancy for people. It’s not necessarily your bread and butter, which is like your product. But it’s just the way it’s packaged so that people care, which has to be changed all the time, literally, we are on, and you might be in email lists with people who launch, you know, a few times a year, we might be one of those people in the things that might change. We’ll be the first in line to tell you things change. We just got out of School of Sales Live, it being live was part of the offer. And that will not happen for a couple more rounds, or years, or whatever it is. And that is okay. That was part of the offer, and it’s over. And so I would tell you is that if you’re going to invest $50,000, $20,000, with a coach, who is going to say, you know, here’s how we’re going to your offer. I really hesitate to say that it’s anymore than a one time package deal. Would you agree?

Macy
Honestly, that’s a good point.

Kat
And I would not have known that a couple years ago.

Macy
So because people get kind of like numb to offers a little bit. And so the offer is just, I mean it’s important, but it’s not the thing to obsess over.

Kat
And so in a very similar way, maybe it’s like, oh, well I’m going to take this course on webinars, I’m going to take this course on, what’s something else, evergreen, ads, which all are things that can help you move the needle. Because what they are is containers. We signed up for a course, it was $20,000. And one of the strategies within this course was that you use a Facebook group. And during this course, I was watching an old video, I don’t know how I stumbled on it, but it was in the portal. And one of the coaches said, oh, we archived the Facebook group. We don’t even use it. Because it’s like, it’s an entire job in itself.

Macy
And it’s like in the course to do that, though.

Kat
Yes, it’s a part of the entire machine. And I just kind of scratched my head. I said, good. Because what we know at Guide Culture, and what you’re gonna know when you leave this podcast is that strategy is just the container that holds the juice. And that juice is the skills you have to make any strategy work. So maybe you have a Stanley Cup, maybe you have a Yeti cup, maybe you have a regular old mug, and maybe you have a juice glass, it really doesn’t matter. Because whatever’s in there will taste the same. It’s just the experience you have drinking it. It’s the container that is fun to play with, whether it be ads, Facebook group, whatever, but very similar to like that offer how it changes strategies are also a revolving door. I mean, I just gotta saythis about ads really quick, when there’s an iOS change, ads completely changed because they couldn’t track the data. So it’s not that ads are bad it’s that it’s taking probably double the money to learn your audience. Which is fine when you’re Tony Robbins and you have millions of dollars to overhaul the entire ad system, like God forbid you run ads at the same time as him because he’s trampling you, it’s a revolving door of what’s relevant, what’s working, what’s updated, where your skills can go, you can pivot into a different container.

Macy
You can, no problem.

Kat
Oh, Yeti, if they have a recall, perfect. I have a juice glass, perfect. I have a coffee mug, perfect. I have Stanely, it doesn’t matter. I can pivot, is what you will say. And that gives you freedom. Because you are flexible, you’re confident, and you really don’t even miss a beat. That’s what’s really cool. You can watch people change around you and just know that you can stay exactly where you are in your email list and go hard as heck there because you have the skills and the container of your choice. Choose your container, live your best life, sell as much as you want to sell. That’s right, because sales skills will always, always, always out beat a sales strategy, in the long run. There might be people who are using a sales strategy right now and you’re like ooh, Kat, I saw they went fast. I saw they did. A sales strategy can be applied quickly. It will also fizzle quickly. Your sales skills will be what can convert into each of those over time for you. So long haul for the long haul.

Macy
That’s my thing. It’s a long haul because the strategy thing about Facebook in itself, a Facebook group I mean, that has come and gone in, what, five years? Like I’m thinking about how they like, I feel like Facebook was even really used for business until not that long ago. And then when it first started, everyone, like their algorithm, like their business page, was like on someone’s feed. And within a couple of years that has been gone, it’s not even possible anymore. And now hardly anyone gets on Facebook for business, right? You have Facebook groups, no one actually looks in there. And it’s been like five years max. And imagine you if you built your whole business, your whole strategy, on that one feature. And you’re like, but now what, though? You know, the timing worked. Now I can’t get anywhere else. But with your sales skills, like the way Kat was just like, oh, good, like that can be your attitude in your journey forever.

Kat
And hopefully, that is freeing to you. Because honestly, in that moment, I was a little bit annoyed. Then five seconds later, I was free. Because I texted one of our teammates. I said, this is perfect. We know that we can actually stay in this group and continue it and make it work. Because I’m not chained to it. I know that when you have sales goals, you can actually make any container work. Because I guarantee you that if we needed to make MySpace work, I guarantee it. I don’t want to though, at that’s the thing, you can get free. That’s exactly right. And then the next thing that we ended up talking about was probably the most fascinating because like I said, in the very beginning of this podcast, she has multiple 300,000 plus followers.

And engaged. I think that’s even more impressive for me.

70,000 likes on one of those posts. I mean, I’ve never even touched in on legitimate content. Like it wasn’t for fun, trending, dancing. It was legit her face talking to the camera about what she does. So really, really crazy talented, gifted, brilliant, really brilliant. And this woman has a husband and two boys, by the way, like she is just a boss. It’s just teenage boys, too. So anyway, what was fascinating is how she was saying, you know, you would assume that once you’ve built an audience, the numbers would shake out, at least enough people would buy. And I think some are, it has shaken her so much that she has said, hey, q4 is my time to only focus on selling, period. That is it. And that is her commitment. And what is so important for you to know, whether you have 200, 2000, or 200,000 followers, if you are not converting who you already have, what makes you think you can convert anyone new. It is not that your audience is the wrong people. Even if you’ve completely pivoted careers, people are people. And if you serve, like the whole makeup thing, if you really sell confidence and vehicle is five minute makeup, I guarantee you there are people in the audience who want that. People are people are people, but if you cannot convert who you already have, there’s very little to no way that you can convert anybody new. Because it’s not their fault that they don’t want what you have, right? And that is another freeing thought that you can actually double down on something instead of wondering, well, what’s the growth strategy? Now, going back to strategy, you can actually learn skills that say, you know what I can actually, like, see these people, help them feel seen, get into conversation with them, find out what they want. And then you can take that information, fling it into your content, and then cast the net to hundreds more people who will relate to what you do into what the other people want. And in a recent podcast and conversation we had with Casey Graham, he said that, nothing, really nothing, should be done except selling until that million dollar mark. I personally like to think of it in revenue, just because it is so easily measurable in your business. And it shows that you are converting people. And it is so possible to get to a million dollars in sales. I almost want from this moment forward, no matter what you’ve been told about money, for you to see that as not that big of a number. Because it’s really not, because here’s what it shakes out to look like. If you have a product that is $997. And you only made one sale a day for two years. That is a million dollars in revenue. And what happens if you think about it like that? And chances are if you know how to sell you can do more than that surely, which is the good news, that’s I’m saying, only one a day once you’ve really learned how to do this. As you do that, as you are in that flow of selling, what ends up happening is that you’re in conversation with the real individual people. And just like when you convert who you already have, you end up being able to leverage which means make easier your content creation, you actually get to clarify, refine, and speak specifically to the people in your audience. And like we said, people are people are people, you can actually do this repeatedly to $1 million. That is, there’s not a single strategy that will get you there. I promise you, on my actual life, like there’s not just one, there’s a million, there’s a million ways to get to a million dollars, and the only common denominator is selling.

Macy
Truthfully. And also, I just want to comment on this one sale a day. Like, I think that someone who is not used to that, like they probably hear that, and I think they would think so every day have to start over. Like you have to start over and sell to like find a new prospect start a new conversation. They actually snowball sales directly. So it’s like, if you are just like this nurturing is selling, if you’re changing the way someone thinks publicly on social, it’s not just one person. It’s like 50 people, depending on your following. Like, I remember when I was at that conference, this girl was like I only have 300 followers. And I was like angel, that’s double the people that are in this room right now. And the room was packed, it was 150 people. And it felt like buzzing, it just felt like so many. I was like, that’s double the amount of people. So even if you change 50 people’s perspective, based on following of 300 people, they just make decisions on different timelines. So someone makes a decision on Monday, someone talks to their spouse, and they make the decision on Tuesday and someone else, you know, sleeps on it. They make a decision on Wednesday. And it’s the same site process. It’s just kind of rolling in momentum, if that’s a word, over time. You know, that’s how we roll over here. It’s like every sale we sell we make, it was made, who knows when, they just actually made the final decision and took action on this particular day.

Kat
And not to mention that momentum that comes in conversations actually gives you more creativity, a million more ideas, more ways to handle objections publicly.

Macy
I mean, this whole podcast is based off a conversation that you had.

Kat
It’s based on a conversation with a really good objection. A really good concern. And a lot of things that we talked about.

Macy
And we have a workshop happening next week. And that was based off a conversation you had.

Kat
I’ve told y’all, she is incredibly successful, has so much legitimacy. The unique thing about this is that she wanted to take her one membership, to like fifty million dollars. And that’s an incredibly lofty goal that I know is possible when she harnesses this skill. And what’s interesting, though, is that she had a pretty high revenue, hundreds of 1000s in revenue, and I asked well, where does the membership lie in that? She said, it’s by far the smallest of all the hundreds of 1000s of dollars, it’s like probably a few 1000 in membership or something. And my one advice to her was when you tunnel vision on this one product, there’s a lot of things you could sell. What you should do is focus on this one product until a million dollars, not even a question.

Macy
Oh, yes, it would not take her that long.

Kat
Exactly. And what’s cool is a million dollars might sound like a lot. What’s cool is the wins along the way, the first one 20,000, the first 2000. It’s cool when you see the snowball effect of all this, and you just keep your head down. The message here is that you absolutely can get to 1 million with one product. If someone is telling you that you need a small, medium, and large, I’ve heard the popcorn theory, people will pick the middle, and the amount of energy, the people telling you that have massive teams. They have massive teams who can put out the content.

Macy
And they probably got to this point by having one product, they got to the massive team that they have, and they’re able to popcorn because of one product that they obsessed over. I know one person you’re probably thinking of had one product that he sold and now has all these offers. You know what I’m saying? Yes, but he didn’t get there with a bunch of offers. He got there with one.

Kat
Exactly. So know that beyond the shadow of a doubt it’s possible and that’s actually what you should do. So that when you do create more things in the future, one, you have the funds to do it. But also you have a credibility behind you. And it’s a proven skill that’s refined. And if you feel this way, man, I would love to get to 1 million with one product through the way that we’re saying it today. There’s a workshop happening. September 20, at 7:30pm, Eastern Time, with Macy and Kitty, your hosts today, 1 million with One Product workshop. I know and I honestly cannot wait to look back on that workshop and see who has grown since then. Because you do have your gift, you have a solution to people’s problem. And I really believe that it’s going to be unlocked.

Macy
Yeah, absolutely. You’ve got to apply whether you want to workshop or you want to just come and watch. Definitely apply because we want to make sure the right people are in the right seats to be able to get the right results. So all that information will be linked in the show notes below. But definitely, definitely apply. Come September 20th.

Kat
Yeah, Septmember 20th at 7:30 to apply. You don’t need to have made a single dollar.

Macy
Oh yeah, in fact, good. If you’ve never made a dollar. Also if you have made $300,000, whatever, you’re like I’m trying to get to a million .

Kat
Yes, whatever level you are at apply to come. You can either watch or you can be in the, you know, kind of coaching seat with me and Macy, just know that you are welcome. And I really, really believe it’s going to be a game changer for you. We cannot wait to see you there. The application link will be in the show notes. And we’ll see you on September 20th.

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